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橙子发表于 2005-5-26 05:43

诗品

只是为了提高自己的文学修养在这里发帖子自学，有错误或误解一定要告诉我呀，呵呵 
 E.E.CUMMINGS
 (1894-1962)
 l(a
 (1923)
 l(a
 le
 af
 fa
 ll
 s)
 one
 l 
 iness
Unlike the other poems, " I(a " does not at first seem to have any of the characteristics normally associated with poetry. It had no meter, rhyme,,or imagery. It has no repeated sounds , no figures of speech, no symbols. It cannot even be read aloud because its "lines" are made up of fragments of words. In spite of its odd appearance, however, it does present an idea that is poetic. Reconstructed, the words that Cummings broke apart are
 " l (a leaf falls) one l iness."
 我觉得像这样的诗还挺好玩儿的
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arcangle 发表于 2005-5-26 06:44

晕死，原来这诗是要这么看的啊！[em06]

橙子发表于 2005-5-27 00:37

Yes, the poem expresses a conventional poetic theme: the loneliness and isolation of the individual. At the same time, by breaking words into bits and pieces, Cummings emphasizes the possibilities of language and suggests the need to break out of customary ways of using words to define experience.
It is true that most poems, particularly those divided into stanzas, look like poems, and it is also true that poems tend to use compressed language. Beyond this, however, what makes a poem a poem is more a matter of degree than a question of whether or not it conforms to a strict set of rules. A poem is likely to use more imagery, figurative language, rhyme, and so on than a prose piece-but, then again, it may not.

lsyongren 发表于 2005-5-30 07:41

你好啊，橙子，我是二外旅馆二学位的，以前是英语专业的，喜欢英语诗歌，可以和你切磋么？你选的E。E。CUMMINGS 的诗不错，我早就听到过他的特别的诗了，我喜欢！我的QQ是170747720，你可以加我：）

橙子发表于 2005-5-31 01:03

楼上的好，谢谢你喜欢我贴的这首诗。刚刚开始自学就有人和我互相切磋是一件很高兴的事呢，欢迎指导，呵呵。
既然有人对这个感兴趣，我就继续贴好了。
[IMG]http://www.poets.org/images/authors/eecummin.jpg[/IMG]
photo Marion Morehouse, 1960
E. E. Cummings 
Edward Estlin Cummings was born in Cambridge, Massachusetts, in 1894. He received his B.A. in 1915 and his M.A. in 1916, both from Harvard. During the First World War, Cummings worked as an ambulance driver in France, but was interned in a prison camp by the French authorities (an experience recounted in his novel, The Enormous Room) for his outspoken anti-war convictions. After the war, he settled into a life divided between houses in rural Connecticut and Greenwich Village, with frequent visits to Paris.
In his work, Cummings experimented radically with form, punctuation, spelling and syntax, abandoning traditional techniques and structures to create a new, highly idiosyncratic means of poetic expression. Later in his career, he was often criticized for settling into his signature style and not pressing his work towards further evolution. Nevertheless, he attained great popularity, especially among young readers, for the simplicity of his language, his playful mode and his attention to subjects such as war and sex. At the time of his death in 1962, he was the second most widely read poet in the United States, after <a href="http://www.poets.org/rfros" target="_blank" >Robert Frost</A>.
A Selected Bibliography 
Poetry 
& (1925) 1 x 1 (1944) 1/20 (1936) 73 Poems (1962) Complete Poems (1991) Fifty Poems (1941) Ninety-five Poems (1958) No Thanks (1935) Tom (1935) Tulips and Chimneys (1923) ViVa (1931) XLI Poems (1925) 
Letters 
Eimi (1933) The Enormous Room (1922) 
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橙子发表于 2005-6-1 07:24

确实，从诗歌中可以发现不同语言各自的优势，比如说 E.E.CUMMINGS的这首表现loneliness的诗是不能仅仅用汉语中的“孤独”两个字翻译的，后者不能称其为诗。这与很多唐诗绝句不能被贴切地翻译成英文是同样的道理。我只想对英文诗歌有初步的了解，所以还是从对诗歌的定义开始吧。我选了一本英文原版的教人写诗的书当阅读理解的教材来用，有创意吧，呵呵呵。
Defining poetry
Throughout history and across various national and cultural boundaries, poetry has held an important place. In ancient China and Japan, for example, poetry was prized above all else, and no individual was considered educated who could not write a good poem. 
To the ancient Greeks and Romans, poetry was the medium of spiritual and philosophical expression. Epics such as The Iliad and The Aeneid are written in verse, and so are dramas such as Oedipus the King and Antigone. Passages of the Bible,the Koran, and the Hinduholy books are also written in poetry. Today, throughout the world, poetry continues to delight and to inspire. For many people, in many places, poetry is the language of the emotions, the medium of expression they use when they speak from the heart.
What exactly is poetry? 
我把英文诗理解为中国的水墨山水虫鱼画一样，有的浓墨重彩，有的写意风趣，与唐诗平仄规整的风格不同，英文诗虽然有的也注重押韵（尤其是古诗），但是我觉得英文诗更善于把形寓于诗中，看上去十分有趣。呵呵，也许这是初学者肤浅的表现吧，从好玩儿的开始喽，嘿嘿嘿

lsyongren 发表于 2005-6-3 01:09

橙子，你好厉害，想来我还是个小辈啊。你就多贴些吧，我得当你为老师了。我知道汉语是重"意”，而英语重“形”？是么

橙子发表于 2005-6-3 20:47

别说我厉害，我一点都不厉害；
别让我当老师，我还不是很老呢，一般老而已；
其它的,学诗的时候再给你回吧，
我先灌水玩儿一会儿~~

lsyongren 发表于 2005-6-4 02:53

橙子，你说的可是不大对啊，所谓“闻道有先后，术业有专攻，师不必贤于弟子，弟子不必不如师啊”！你们下次学哪位诗人的作品啊，告诉我,我准备一下，可以和你深入交流的。：）looking forward to yr reply!

橙子发表于 2005-6-6 03:28

[QUOTE]汉语是重"意”，而英语重“形”？是么[/QUOTE]
我不是这个意思，我是觉得由于英语本身文字的特点更容易让诗人们在字形排列上做文章，这一个loneliness的词就被排成一个落叶的形状了（A leaf falls），而汉语中更讲究字数的准确平整，如五言七绝等，很难把形旁和声部分开来作文章。

橙子发表于 2005-6-6 04:01

Reconizing kinds of poetry
Almost all poetry can be assigned to one of two categories: narrative poems, which recount a story, and lyric poems (generally shorter than narrative poems), which communicate a speaker's mood, feelings, or state of mind.
Narrative poetry
Although any brief poem that tells a story, such as Edwin Arlington Robinson's "Richard Cory", or even a popular song like Bruce Springsteen's "My Hometown" may be considered a narrative poem, the two most familiar forms of narrative poetry are the epic and the ballad.
......待续

橙子发表于 2005-6-7 00:14

这些都是老生长谈的了，
就像我的第一帖一样，concrete poetry 也许在我们这一代眼里更有趣一些。
With roots in the ancient Greek pattern poems and the sixteenth and seventeenth-century emblem poems, contemporary concrete poetry uses words-and, sometimes, different fronts, type sizes, and even colors of printing-to shape a picture on the page. The form of a concrete poem is not somethig that emerges from the poem's words and images, but something predetermined by the visiual image the poet has decided to creat. Although some concrete poems are little more than novelties, others-like the following poem-can be original and enlightening.

橙子发表于 2005-6-7 00:34

几个例子：
<DIV align=center>
<H3>George Herbert (1593-1633) </H3>
<H3>Easter Wings</H3></DIV>
<DIV class=a> </DIV>
<DIV class=a><a href="http://eir.library.utoronto.ca/rpo/display/poem973.html#1" target="_blank" > 1</A>Lord, who createdst man in wealth and store, </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 2 Though foolishly he lost the same, </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 3 Decaying more and more, </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 4 Till he became </DIV>
<DIV class=a><a href="http://eir.library.utoronto.ca/rpo/display/poem973.html#5" target="_blank" > 5</A> Most poore: </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 6 With thee </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 7 O let me rise </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 8 As larks, harmoniously, </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 9 And sing this day thy victories: </DIV>
<DIV class=a><a href="http://eir.library.utoronto.ca/rpo/display/poem973.html#10" target="_blank" > 10</A>Then shall the fall further the flight in me. </DIV>
<DIV class=a> </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 11My tender age in sorrow did beginne </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 12 And still with sicknesses and shame. </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 13 Thou didst so punish sinne, </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 14 That I became </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 15 Most thinne. </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 16 With thee </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 17 Let me combine, </DIV>
<DIV class=a><a href="http://eir.library.utoronto.ca/rpo/display/poem973.html#18" target="_blank" > 18</A> And feel thy victorie: </DIV>
<DIV class=a><a href="http://eir.library.utoronto.ca/rpo/display/poem973.html#19" target="_blank" > 19</A> For, if I imp my wing on thine, </DIV>
<DIV class=a> 20Affliction shall advance the flight in me. </DIV>
Notes
<A>1</A>] store: ample goods, abundance. 
<A>5</A>] The length of the lines decreases to reflect their content, diminished man. 
<A>10</A>] Herbert alludes to the paradox of the "fortunate fall" or felix culpa. Only by sinning with Eve, and being cast out of the Garden of Eden into a world of labour, pain, and death, did Adam enable the second Adam, Christ, to redeem man and show a love and forgiveness that otherwise could never have been. 
<A>18</A>] feel: "feel this day" in 1633. The two added words disturb the clear metrical scheme (which has six syllables in lines 3, 8, and 13) and are not found in the manuscript of the poem. 
<A>19</A>] imp: Herbert suggests that if he adds his feathers to God's wings, he will fly the higher because of God's might. Sometimes feathers were grafted or imped into a falcon's wing to increase the power of its flight. Note that this metaphor suggests that the wing-like stanza on one page represents Herbert's wings, and the wing-stanza on the facing page represents God's.

橙子发表于 2005-6-7 01:12

好累呀，该歇歇了，
心也歇了

lsyongren 发表于 2005-6-26 08:03

"好累呀，该歇歇了，
心也歇了"
累就是身体上感觉到累了，何以心也累啊？
有什么麻烦的事么？
接着发帖子啊，我想能跟你学到好多的东东啊！加油啊！
还有啊，累了就好好休息啊！

橙子发表于 2005-6-26 22:40

谢谢楼上，最近在休假，懒惰散漫了很多，
我从来对宗教和政治都不感兴趣，所以并不喜欢上面那首诗，
只是列个好玩的形出来，过两天贴个别人作的评论吧，
自己不愿意动脑子想宗教的事，
我一直觉得已经自律的很辛苦了，
不想再给自己上别的枷锁，
简简单单，清清淡淡的多好~~

橙子发表于 2005-7-7 06:35

上接11楼
Epic poems recount the accomplishments of heroic figures, typically including settings of sweeping scale, superhuman feats, and gods and supernarural beings. The language of epic poems is elevated and frequently elaborate. Epics span many cultures- from Homer's Odyssey(Greek) to Beowulf (Anglo-saxon) to The Epic of Gilgamesh (Babylonian). In ancient times, epics were handed down through an oral tradition; more recently, poets have written literary epics, such as John Milton's Paradise Lost and Nobel Prize-winning poet Derek Walcott's 1990 Omeros, which follow many of the same conventions.

橙子发表于 2005-7-7 07:02

为什么虫子都咬我，
气死我了[em03]

橙子发表于 2005-7-14 20:55

The Ballad is another type of narrative poetry with roots in an oral tradition. Originally intended to be sung, a ballad uses repeated words and phrases, including a refrain, to advance its story. Some-but not all-ballads use the ballad stanza. For examples of traditional ballads in this text, see "Bonny Barbara Allen",Sir Patrick Spence",and "Westren Wind". Dudley Randall's "Ballad of Birmingharm" and Gwendolyn Brook's "The Ballad of Chocolate Mabbie" are examples of modern ballads.

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